MySpace is Dead - Here's the Proof

Music is what people do when they're away from computers.

If you're in the business of music, you need to concentrate on social networking applications that work on devices which fit in your pocket, not on your desk.  As more and more people start to access email from handheld devices, which operate regardless of where they are, we're going to see sites such as MySpace sink deeper and deeper into the cyber graveyard.

Just like mp3.com.  Just like Friendster.  Just like so many before it.

Bottom line... Social technologies succeed only when they fit into the lives of people.

MySpace was fun for a while, but the novelty has worn off.  And the same concept has moved on to better technology.  People no longer have to be hardwired to a desktop computer in order to connect with people online.

Can MySpace add mobile technology?  Sure.  They already have.  But that's like trying to retrofit a Ford Pinto with a racing engine.  There is only so far you can go with it.

You want something that is built for how people use the Internet now.  Something like Twitter.

Sure, there are still people on MySpace.  But the hipsters who listen to music are sick of it and have moved on.  Just look at International Delete Your Myspace Account Day and you'll see plenty of reasons why.

There is a window of opportunity now, before services like Twitter have peaked, for you to get in early and dominate.

Had you been one of the first people on mp3.com, you could have easily been at the top of their download charts.  When they started paying money for downloads, the guys on top were making $10,000/month or more.

Had you been one of the first people on MySpace, you could have easily had 500,000 friends (or more). Jeffree Star joined MySpace on 10/1/2003, has over 800,000 friends, a management deal with the Firm, a #1 album on the iTunes dance chart, a TV show in development, and his own line of clothing, which is distributed via Hot Topic.

Somebody is going to do this on the next social networking site to take off.  I'm betting that site is going to be Twitter, for exactly the reasons I've listed above.  If you want to get on Twitter and completely dominate it, read this book.

Don't be left out.

Comments

[Indie Messiah]

I bought your package. It's interesting, but I do not think MySpace is dead. There is no way that you can have 200+ plus million people in one place and not find a benefit. Just like everything else, and you know this for a fact, you must be creative. Sure, the old ways may not work. I also have Bob Bakers writings on MySpace. They are similar to yours offered here.

MySpace has a lot of potential to network. I think discounting that is not a great idea. One of the things that Indie's do too much of is hop around and not focus. I like your books, I bought them, but it is not 100% accurate to say that MySpace has no potential.

Just a thought.

[Butch Leman]

I was skeptical. Now that you put it like that though!!! I am going to leave a myspace page up and branch out so I can be ready for the next big thing.

[David Hooper]

Indie Messiah,

I didn't say there was no potential in MySpace. There is potential for everything.

Numbers don't lie though. MySpace is on its way out. There may be a ton of people on there, but the downward shift is happening. And if you want "first mover advantage" on what's next, you have to act before it's too late.

Once a movement starts to be recognized, it's almost impossible to get in on it. I'll post more on this shortly, as it's a very important topic.

With that said...

Keep MySpace. It doesn't take any effort just to leave it up. Don't neglect what is happening now though. Wishful thinking isn't going to make MySpace turn around. Again, numbers don't lie.

Thanks for your comments!

[David Hooper]

Indie Messiah,

Just posted more thoughts related to your comments...

Nobody Remembers Who Won 2nd Place
http://www.musicmarketing.com/2008/06/nobody-remember.html

Thanks again for sparking the discussion!

[jagan ramamoorthy]

About Myspace, I have my doubts about its potential for Musicians and Media folks. The best network for Artists that I have come across is neither Myspace nor Facebook, but Linkedin--REAL people and very GREAT moderation by the Linkedin team there. I have found some of my very OLD batch mates, colleagues using Linkedin.
I am not a skeptic, so, I won't allow Myspace being bashed either, nor Facebook being discarded as a "Nothing but a Sexual encounters drama zone"
My qstn to all those who complain "Why do you even get Online?" Why can't you go and sit in a Park? Exercise? or maybe even sit in McDonalds and eat your French Fries? I go everyday to a nearby park for a ten-twelve rounds of the PArk ground for my daily walking exercise. Believe me, I see people coming there--sit there and chit-chat, when their intention or real motivator to visit the park musta been to "Reduce weight" It is never about someone else. It is always about us, Me, Mine.
I am very greatly inspired by Don Miguel Ruiz' work "The Four Agreements" Try and read that and most importantly try and IMPLEMENT that even in your Online life. you won't feel Cheated. After all even to be cheated, one needs to make that CHOICE of being available to be CHEATED by another.
My last point here would be:-
Don't bash Myspace, because you like something else. Maybe some guys or girls just come to Myspace for FUN and not for REAL stuff. Let them enjoy.
Jagan Ramamoorthy
www.spundana.org

[YouRockRadio]

This is where I disagree. The issue is that people are hopping from this site to that and running around like chickens with their head cut off searching for the next big thing. If we all do this then nothing will ever happen because there is no focus.

Twitter is not that new to begin with in Internet years, so I don't think that it is any better or worse than anything else. And the numbers? What numbers? Every time I ask an Indie to PROVE they sell anything anywhere I get resistance. Mainly because they don't. I find this out after they finally get honest. I knew it going in, but that is always the wall I hit whenever I bring up the subject.

I have been in this Internet business for a long time. I started actually on the Web in 1979 in the military when most of you were either in diapers or didn't even know what a computer looked like. I have been involved in the Indie movement since the 80's. Everybody lies in this business and there is no revenue of any substance being made by the majority. There are exceptions, but they are few and far between and usually have a lot of financial help along the way.

Working MySpace for sales, or Twitter, or Whoeveristhisweeksbigthing.com is not the answer. The answer lies in creative avenues that bring in revenue streams that people normally don't think about. Since nobody actually buys music very much, we must start thinking about other of plans of action. I realize this is vague, however you sell your info for 27 bucks, I won't give mine away either. Not here anyway.

To say that a network with over 200 million people has no value as a resource is not accurate. It depends on what you use it for and how you administrate it. If you are talking about instant sales, well... That is not reality anywhere.

[david]

THe thing that killed Myspace was they stabbed the musicians in the back. They deleted so many band accounts for no reason and made it tough for all the bands and musicians to market themselves but the Phishers and spammers still have a field day with it.

[chris]

myspace is actually very well still alive, and has helped me A LOT with networking for my music

if you read this, USE MYSPACE, IT CAN HELP GREATLY!!!

i see what points he is trying to make, but it is not the best way to go about things

[Robert Calkin]

Sorry, but I have met thousands of people on Myspace that I never would have before. I tried Twitter on your suggestion and so far, feel it is utter and total crap. Not even close to Myspace. Myspace isn't to "get famous" or "get signed". It's for networking. Period. And 200 million people will ALWAYS be enough to network, even if "the numbers go down"!

[David Hooper]

YouRockRadio -- You are absolutely correct about people jumping from one thing to the next. And this is why I like Twitter...because it works with YOUR site. It drives traffic to you rather than being the destination itself.

Who says people aren't buying music? Look at the numbers for CD Baby! Plenty of people buy music.

And I never said MySpace had no value. I simply said people are moving on and if you want to jump on the next big thing, you need to make a move now, while you have a window of opportunity.

For those of you talking about networking... It's great to know a lot of people, but quality is more important than quantity. Somebody posted here about asking "friends" on MySpace to come to your gig. Do you think that would happen? If not, they're not true fans.

Something to think about...

Thanks for your comments, guys!

[I was there when mp3.com was big for indies]

I was there when mp3.com was big for independent artists. They made a bunch of money off the artists. There were a huge number of artists on the site, plus their fans that clicked on the site to hear bands music.

Where are they now? They just tanked that whole thing (made their money and walked). MySpace was the next thing. They made their money on the backs of all the artists that suddenly made it cool. When it tanks, there's something else. So yeah, don't trust that myspace is yours forever - because as soon as it is losing money or something else comes along - bye bye - all your work and fans are gone. And hey, do you actually have all your fans info off myspace? Like to send them a newsletter or something? Right. No you don't. So tomorrow, when myspace goes down or they decide to delete your account for whatever reason (this has happened to people by accident, but they still can't get their fans back except by doing all that adding and finding all over again) - bye bye to your bloated 'fan base'.

Sure use your creative marketing to use whatever tools are going to work best for you. As far as I'm concerned, it's even too late for Twitter. You are not getting in on the ground floor as soon as anyone tells you to get in on the ground floor - it's too late.

So get your fans emails. Have a website. Talk to your fans. Build your career. Use the tools, but never count on them.

My two cents.

[Guitarasaur]

When I first started "meet", "friend", and "connection" meant something different. I "knew" a large portion of my audience and they knew me. The key to the future is convincing someone you've never seen in person to spend $.99 to hear your song. AND: Secondary merch streams will feed you. T-shirts and cassettes (they were new once, honest) easily outpaced album sales three to one ( one for Mom and one for Dad and one more the next time we saw them.

[YouRockRadio]

The problem is I don't believe those "numbers". I am not going to go as far as say they are fabricated, but they are not selling those items on the Internet, they are referring people from live performances. You tell somebody at a gig... "Yeah, I have my CD on CD Baby", and they buy it... Sometimes.

I agree that Twitter has some value, but no more or less than anything else. And the fact that you have to babysit it and come up with stupid things to say is annoying for mature people like myself.

I was Vice President of Musicforte.com/Inc. During that time I watched all these "numbers" and they were weak. Many times somebody would come to our facility and make claim to some big movement of product at CD Baby, iTunes, etc., and I would kindly ask for the numbers so I could establish what was going on. Every time I got stonewalled and told it was none of my business. That may be true, but I was pitching a much more dynamic plan to them and wanted to know what it was that made them successful while millions of others fail. I have the answer to that, in part and parcel it applies to your great ways of thinking and your approach to marketing, I do commend you for your brilliant ideas and presentation on your shows, etc, and I am in awe that you have the balls to post this on your sales page, that takes guts, but my point is simply this; Musicians are too busy chasing their tail already. The industry is not helping either by giving away music for free, and the value of our product has become non-existent to most consumers.

What I would love to do is to take brilliant minds like ours, and the good people here, and form the largest company the music world has EVER seen! Create revenue streams outside of just music, create health/dental, life insurance plans, and REAL retirement opportunity once vested. There is nothing like that in our industry. If we got together as a group of Indies and pulled this off, I am telling you that our legacy would be greater than all of the music compositions ever written!

Focus and commitment and the power of multiplicity is the key. Not creating more circle-jerk websites that we have to attend to. If you like one or the other, pick a couple and focus on that. MySpace is great to network on, Twitter is good buzz, and Facebook might be groundwork for future investment types, but take these and wrok them properly, don;t just heave them aside when "the next big nothing" comes along. It is all going to come out to the same result if you establish what you are there for. Selling music on any network is probably a no-go for the most part. A network of 200 Million people is so large guys that you cannot tap that potential in your lifetime! Sure, the spammers and scammers are gonna be there, that means they are doing something right because they have something these idiots want. It is the nature of the beast. Twitter is polluted with garbage already from the get-go, by its very nature it is junk mail. But it has a purpose, just keep using it for that and drop the unreasonable expectation that you are gonna make a million bucks and you won't be disappointed.

With all of the hats we wear as independents it is no wonder much of the music we produce blows. We don't have time to be REAL musicians writing great music, we are too busy "twittering" our time away. If we form this "organization" I envision, we can capitalize on each others strengths and leverage time. Then we can create great entertainment that people can cheer about.

[David Hooper]

YouRockRadio - Yes, the guys selling the most music on CD Baby are doing so via live performances. Derek Sivers has said that and encouraged people to get out and play live because of it.

My whole point about Twitter is that it can be used to take things offline. This, in my opinion, makes it a lot more valuable than the sites which have yet to make the mobile/offline transition.

http://www.musicmarketing.com/2008/05/twitter---using.html has my thoughts on making that happen.

Thanks again for your comments.

David

[David Hooper]

James Scott - Yes, it comes down to business. MusicMarketing.com is a business, just like most bands are...or at least claim to be.

$27 won't make or break me, but the information within the product might very way make a huge difference to a band or musician who acts upon it.

There is more to what I'm saying than just getting on Twitter. That is the easy part, which is why so many bands feel that they're "working" simply by having an account.

Simply being on a site doesn't mean a thing. You've got to work it if you want results.

Thanks for your comments!

[6OfCups]

After reading everyone's comments, I came to the conclusion, it's not so much about getting in on the "next big Web 2.0" site, but rather it's about finding a site that both fills your needs and preferences while, at the same time, gives you access to your audience.

While, technically, the popularity of MySpace is dwindling, if there are musicians who still find it useful, are used to (and enjoy) the layout and have created an established community there, why not stay until the site ends up being a ghost town? If it's working for you and you feel the time you spend there is productive, there's nothing wrong with that.

I think what David is trying to say is that a site like Twitter offers new opportunities for those who found MySpace to be a chore and didn't have such great luck there. For some, the way Twitter works may be a perfect fit and an interesting place to connect with new, creative people.

I, too, bought David's Twitter product. While I learned some things about Twitter that I didn't know, I was surprised to find it was the MyBlogLog ebook that he included which was most helpful to me. I had never even heard of MyBlogLog before. It's not so much that I jumped on it because I felt I missing out on something, it was that MyBlogLog felt like something I could manage, something I would enjoy and something that fits in with my marketing plan.

Personally, I don't have time to keep up with the latest trends in Web 2.0 sites. I'd rather come to a blog like this (or pay $27 for a product) that has someone else do the research for me...then I choose what resonates me with and what doesn't.

For all those who are MySpace diehards--good on you! I, myself, never liked the site and am eager to give a site like Twitter a try with the hope I have just as much fun with it as you guys have had with MySpace.

[YouRockRadio]

The notion that 200 million plus people equals "Ghost Town" is hardly accurate.

I hate... Absolutely Hate MySpace with a passion, always have. If you look at my page however it represents what can be good about it if used properly (see http://yourockradio.net Yes that is our MySpace url.)

I think that as websites go it is the biggest piece of crap around. It is full of junk advertising, spammers, and chicks that tempt you with boobs hanging out all over the place. (Sounds like some rock clubs I have played in. :) But you are missing my point entirely.

It is not where you hang out, it is the quality of the work you do there and what you focus on. I am not there to sell music, nor will I even try to at Twitter. You stated that "Myspace is Dead" and your proof was that Twitter was the new thing. That isn't proof, that is an opinion based on your personal experience. I bought the book OK? So I am willing to give you props for writing it and exploring the subject, but proof was a little bit vague.

Now... Let me tell you what MySpace created for me... You ready? I get paid over 1000 dollars a week to network there. How did I do that? People pay me 200 dollars a week to connect with other bands, clubs, and certain other network activities for them. The right person saw the potential of what I told them and they told others, now I get paid to do what I do.

I explained to these people from the gate that selling music there was a waste of time, as it is is on Twitter or anywhere else on the Internet. I know this for a FACT my friends, and one of you just backed up my statement on one of the comments here. You cannot make a living selling music on the Internet. A few extra bucks here and there, but not a career level income. Keep your day job is what I recommend.

Now... I manage a band called the Stephan Michael Band. I manage others, but let me explain what just happened yesterday on MySpace. Stephan got multiple interviews with newspapers in his area. They loved his music, saw that he has amassed a pretty good following at MySpace in two months and they offered to help him any way they could. Stephan doesn't have a band, it was my idea to call him a band because solo artists with no rep are hard to sell. The people at the Raleigh Register offered to hook him up with players that would do his music. This was on MySpace. That is what I use it for. Other sites have potential for the same things, but EVERYONE has a damn MySpace page! I don't like the code they have, I don't like News Corp either, but what you are saying is false advertising only in so much as you make a blanket statement that has no foundation.

Facebook is a different animal. Since it was college oriented in the beginning so it caters to a different group of people. MySpace is generally middle to lower income levels, while Facebook is middle to upper. Twitter? I don't know what that is really. It annoys the crap out of me, but I am 48 years old and kids wiping buggers on the wall is not my cup of tea. I do see the potential in it, I have tried it, but I am still remiss to feel very at home there. MySpace sucks too, but the potential to connect with over 200 million people from all walks of life is at least something I can relate to. I liked your book, I will use the information, and I am in no way belittling your intention. I just don't agree with your headline. If it sells more books then I think it is great, just a little bit more information would be needed to make such a bold claim.

Is MySpace the ideal place to market music? Hell no! Neither is anywhere else on the Internet. The real deal is what you mentioned many times in your book and other writings... Fan base building. If you approach that correctly you can do that on any social website. So for one or the other to be better it would almost have to be exclusively geared for that subject alone.

[David Hooper]

YouRockRadio - Just because MySpace has a lot of people doesn't mean that it's dead.

A big part of this business is forecasting trends. And with the way things are going to MySpace, it's going to be more useless in three months than it is now. And more useless in six months than it will be in three.

Taking online applications offline is what is happening...because as you said, music is sold offline.

Can this be done on MySpace? Sure. Your guy got some newspaper interviews with it.

But if you want to connect directly with fans and avoid filters, such as newspapers, Twitter and other "offline" services are the way to go.

[YouRockRadio]

Dead in what regard? That is the part I don't get. You keep saying it, but you don;t clarify. Because you are not there, or don't know what to do with it, it's dead? That is the problem I am having here regarding your comments. This has become some kind of "Twitter" defense, and I have barely mentioned anything negative about it suffice the "buggar on the wall" mentality that goes on over there. Offline? A phone is not offline. You are still connected to some device and that is not offline.

I am going to ask my members to experiment with a few things and use your instructions as well. I think they are legit, and I am not supporting MySpace, I just think your comment is incorrect regarding your "Ghost Town" and "Dead" references. I believe you possibly know what to do with it so you may have a bias.

Trends are what is killing marketing for musicians. It is the "Candle in the Wind" mentality that makes it impossible to create a brand or a foundation. My philosophy is to develop more consistent vehicles that are not dependent on the whims of temporary fixes. Brand loyalty is the bases of this method, not fly-by -night drive by fans.

Twitter until it gets polluted with penis-cream ads, then pollute something else. It is the American way.

[David Hooper]

YouRockRadio - MySpace is dead in that it's past its time. And dead in that people who are not already on it and doing well aren't going to achieve nearly the success as the people who jumped on it when it first started and were able to get in on the ground level.

Twitter, while it may be "connected" online, if a different animal. It's wireless and doesn't rely on a big ass desktop computer to be accessible to users. And that is it's power.

People use Twitter when they're out living their lives...just like they listen to music. Because of this, it's a great thing for musicians.

Again, thanks for your comments! :)

David

[Donnie Christianson]

Great article David, I posted my response below as an article on my blog at www.donniechristianson.com, with a link back to this page. Sorry for such a looong comment, os if you need to edit it, feel free.

I have to agree with David’s view - MySpace is dead in the sense that the majority of bands and solo artists are not going to “profit” from it. But if profit is not your goal, then it’s not ready to go on the cart just yet. :)

I don’t know if Twitter is the next big thing either, but hey, no harm in giving it a shot, right?

As an older musician (40), the Internet has made it much easier for me to gain so much from my music - whether that’s profit, recognition, and enjoyment, whatever. I have no illusions of getting signed again at my age, nor am I crying over it - I’ve been making decent money online with my music for about ten years now, learning a lot about online marketing, and generally having a blast.

I no longer gig (I’m a web designer and developer in my day job, and have no problem revealing that - you'd be surprised at the number of us rockers online that you THINK do this full-time. My day job kicks ass by the way.), so the Internet is my outlet now. Creating and marketing music this way is not necessarily cheaper, but is not nearly as much stress as touring, or meeting the label's expectations on your second album.

I was on Mp3.com only a few months after they started - BUT was still late to the party, so even though I met some people that I can still network with and email once in a while, and I actually made a little money, it was nowhere near what the first folks did (anyone remember 303dreams or the Cynic Project? Now THOSE were some top earners!)

So I can relate to where David sees this going - when Mp3.com pulled the plug, 99% of us were left with nothing to show for our work unless we had exchanged contact info with the people we met there. I’ve noticed Klayton from Celldweller ALWAYS used these communities (Mp3.com, Soundclick, etc) to tease people with content and get everyone back to his main site - and it obviously worked for him.

I’ve been on MySpace about 4 years now. Is it working? Yes, for what I need it to do. I have made sales on my own site and iTunes from a few of my MySpace friends (which by the way my friends list is only a few hundred people - I don’t really spend any time building it).

Am I happy with it? Yeah, it does what I expect. I have a place that is easy to send people to when they want to hear my music, at least until my own site is fully developed, at which point all this content I have on these dozens of sites will be scaled back to just a few teaser items - I for one am taking a lesson from Celldweller.

BUT - MySpace is not helping me make any major strides toward my goals - which is enough sales to go back to music full-time again. Maybe I should promote more, or learn to promote better, or even promote elsewhere. That's what I think David's point is - don't rely on MySpace to fullfill your dreams.

Twitter may or may not be for me, but I’ll know soon enough. There are hundreds of other sites out there. Try them all. I’m on about 50-60 at least. Some are great, others I only login a couple times a year to see if my account still exists.

Take Hooper’s advice and build your fan base on YOUR OWN LIST. Artists First recommend this too - they use the analogy that MySpace is the “pub”, not the “store” - go to the pub to meet people, but bring them back to your store to do the selling or get their contact info.

Until someone comes along and provides a service to manage all these sites for you, there’s no way we artists can keep up with them all. If anyone DOES provide such a service - where are you? So determine your goals, try out a bunch of these sites, and work the ones that align with your goals, funneling them back to your site.

Keep Rockin',
--Donnie